and happy birthday to your son, connor. patti ann: thank you. bill: he's 6? patti ann: 6 yesterday. bill: have a great weekend. patti ann: thank you, you too. bill: "happening now" begins right now. rick: we begin with a fox news alert and we're getting brand new reports that at least one person is dead in a massive explosion that has rocked the capital of norway. here is brand new video just in to fox news. this is the scene outside the government headquarters build anything the oslo. witnesses say there are also several people who are injured, and as you can see, it is a scene of chaos. people running around bewildered, according to eyewitnesses, some folks are walking with blood on their faces, on their hands. norway's prime minister, we're told, is said to be safe. this blast, though, blowing out nearly all the windows of a 20-floor high-rise in oslo covering blocks with rubble and

debris. the story is still breaking, our international desk is working right now to get us new details, and we'll bring you new information as soon as we get it here in the newsroom. jenna: and we'll continue to follow that story, as rick mentioned. in the meantime, another fox news alert for you here in america where we're in the grips of a sweltering heat wave. temperatures at or near the triple digits from kansas to massachusetts, and the shouldering humidity -- smoldering humidity making it feel hotter. rick: it does. jenna: new york city is temperature's around 101, it might feel more like 110. rick: nasty. jenna: washington's 103 degrees on the therm mommer the, feeling more like 116. no wonder people can't get along. at least 22 deaths blamed on the broiling temperatures, and you think it's bad enough to just have to step outside, imagine having to work through this heat. >> it's been difficult. we try to keep ourself cool with ice water so we don't dehydrate

ourself. i mean, like, you've got to find cool shades. we don't want anybody to pass out out here. >> are it's just too hot to work during the day. [laughter] i mean, the turf heats up an dick 15 degrees at least beyond what the ambient temperature is. >> we've had the calls from simple dehydration, heat cramps, heat exhaustion, and then, of course, the worst is heatstroke. so, you know, and countless number other of pre-existing conditions that are just aggravated by this hot weather. jenna: and those are serious side effects. meteorologist rick reichmuth in the weather center today, after one day yesterday, that was enough. >> reporter: actually, i'm headed back out, jenna. these temperatures overnight aren't dropping, excuse me, down to around 80 degrees or so. actually, jenna, we have some breaking news. jenna: thank you so much, we will get back to rick with an update on the weather in a moment. what we're looking at right now is the president, president

obama just about to start a town hall meeting at the university of maryland. how the white house is putting it, this town hall meeting is about a balanced approach to deficit reduction. so we'll listen in to the president here, hear what he has to say about debt, the deficit, any sort of agreement about the debt ceiling and find out if we're getting any closer to any sort of agreement in washington. >> folks up there wore shorts. [laughter] my team said i should not wear shorts. [laughter] my legs aren't good enough to wear shorts. [laughter] >> [inaudible] [laughter] >> nice, thank you. [cheers and applause] i'll tell michelle you said so. [laughter] it is, it is wonderful to be back in maryland. i hope everybody -- [cheers and applause] i hope everybody's keeping cool. staying hydrated. it is great to be back here in

college park. i have a few acknowledgments that i want to make, some special guests that we have. first of all, one of the best governors in the country, martin o'malley, is in the house. [cheers and applause] he was here. there he is over there. by the way, for those of you who have not heard him, outstanding singer and rock and roller. so if you ever want to camp his band, it is topnotch. also one of the best senators in the country, ben carden is in the house -- ben cardin is in the house. [cheers and applause] we've got college park mayor andrew fellows is here. [cheers and applause] former congressman frank

cradoville is here. [applause] you wouldn't know it looking at him, but frank is an outstanding basketball player. [laughter] the terps might be able to use him, even at this age. he is a point guard. got all kinds of moves. [laughter] and i want to thank your still-quasinew president here at maryland, wallace. [cheers and applause] so this is a town hall, i want to spend some time answering some of your questions, but just want to say a few things at the top. first of all, i have to say it's nice to get out of washington. [laughter] [applause] don't get me wrong, there's nothing i enjoy more than sitting hour after hour, day after day debating the fine

points of the federal budget -- [laughter] with members of congress. um -- [laughter] but after a while you do start feeling a little cooped up. so i'm happy to be spending my morning with you. um, i'm going to spend most of my time answering your questions, but let me do say a few words about the debate that's taking place right now in washington about debt and deficits. obviously, it's dominating the news. even though it's taking place in washington, this is actually a debate about you. and everybody else in america. and the choices that we face. most people here whether you're still a student, or you're a graduate, or you're a parent your number one concern is the economy. that's my number one concern. that's the first thing i think about when i wake up in the

morning, it's the last thing i think about when i go to bed at night. and i won't be satisfied until every american who wants a job can find one and until workers are getting paychecks that actually pay the bills, until families don't have to choose between buying groceries and buying medicine, between sending their kids to college and being able to retire in some dignity and some respect. [applause] so -- we have gone through a very difficult two and a half years. the worst financial crisis and the worst recession we've seen since the great depression. and although some progress has been made, there's no doubt that this economy has not recovered as fast as it needs to. and the truth is it's going to take more time because a lot of the problems that we're facing right now -- slow job growth,

stagnant wages -- those were there even before the recession hit. for a decade the average wage, the average income of the american worker had flatlined. those at the very top saw their incomes going up 50%, 100%. but those in the middle, the vast majority of americans, they had been struggling to keep up before the recession hit. and so these challenges weren't caused overnight, they're not going to be solved overnight. but as john f. kennedy once said, our problems are manmade. therefore, they can be solved by man. and the united states, we control our own destiny. the question we have to answer, though, is where do we want to go? what's our vision for the future, and how do we get there?

now, in the short term i've been urging congress to pass some proposals that would give the economy an immediate boost. and these are proposals, by the way, that traditionally have had support in both parties. i want to extend the tax relief that we put in place back in december for middle class families so that you have more money in your paychecks next year. if you've got more money in your paychecks next year, you're more likely to spend it, and that means small businesses, medium-sized businesses and large businesses will have more customers, and they'll be in a position to hire. i want to give more opportunities to all those construction workers out there who lost their jobs when the housing bubble went bust. we could put them to work giving loans to private companies that want to repair our roads and bridges and airports, rebuilding our infrastructure, putting americans to work doing the work that needs to be done. we have workers in need of a job, and a country that's in

need of rebuilding. and if we put those two things together, we can make real progress. i want to cut red tape that stops too many inventers and entrepreneurs from turning new ideas into thriving businesses. i want to, i want congress to send me a set of trade deals that would allow our businesses to sell more products in countries in asia and south america that are stamped with the words "made in america." so these are some things that we could be doing right now. they're proposals in congress as we speak, and congress needs to act now. but i also believe that over the long term the strength of our economy is going to depend on how we deal with the accumulated debt and deficits that have built up over the last decade. and that's what the discussion in washington's about right now. now, i know it's hard to keep up

with the different plans and the press conferences and, you know, the back and forth between the parties, but here's what it all boils down to. it's not that complicated. for a decade we have been spending more money than we take in be. than we take in. last time the budget was balanced was under a democratic president, bill clinton. [applause] and a series of decisions were made whether it was cutting taxes or engaging in the two wars or a prescription drug benefit for seniors that weren't paid for and then a financial crisis on top of that, recovery act to try to pull us out of a great depression, all those thing contributed to this

accumulated debt. and regardless of what you feel about particular policies, some of you may have supported the wars or posed -- or opposed the wars, some of you may have agreed with the recovery act, some of you may be opposed, regardless of your views on the various actions that were taken, the fact is they all cost money, and the result is that there's simply too much debt on america's credit card. neither party is blameless for the decisions that led to this problem. but both parties have a responsibility to solve it. [applause] if we don't solve it, every american will suffer. businesses will be less likely to invest and hire in america. interest rates will rise for

people. who need money to buy a home or a car or go to college. we won't have enough money to invest in the things like education and clean energy or protect the important programs like medicare because we'll be paying more and more interest on this national debt. and that money just flows overseas instead of being spent here. on the things that we need. now, the one thing we can't do, cannot do is decide that we are not going to pay the bills the previous congresses have already racked up, so that's what this whole issue of raising the debt ceiling is all about. basically, there's some people out there who argue we're not going to raise the debt ceiling anymore, and the problem is effectively what that's saying is we're not going to pay some of our bills. well, the united states of america doesn't run out without paying the tab.

we pay our bills. [applause] we meet our obligations. [applause] we have never defaulted on our debt, we're not going to do it now. but even if we raise the debt ceiling, this debate shouldn't just be about avoiding some kind of crisis, particularly a crisis manufactured in washington. this is a rare opportunity for both parties to come together and choose a path where we stop putting so much debt on our credit card. we start paying it down a little bit. and that's what we've been trying to do. so for my part i've already said that i am willing to cut a historic amount of government spending in order to reduce the deficit. i'm willing to cut spending on domestic programs, taking them to the lowest level since dwight

eisenhower. i'm willing to cut defense spending at the pentagon by hundreds of billions of dollars. [applause] i'm willing to take on -- i'm willing to take on the rising costs of health care programs like medicare and medicaid so that these programs will be there for the next generation, for folks, for a population generally that's getting older and living longer. we've got to make sure that these programs which are the crown jewels of our social safety net that -- sort of mixed metaphors there. [laughter] that those are there for the future. and some of these cuts would just eliminate wasteful spending; weapons we don't need, fraud and abuse in our health care system. but i want to be honest, i've agreed to also target some programs that i actually think are worthwhile.

they're cuts that some people in my own party aren't too happy about. and, frankly, i wouldn't make them if money wasn't so tight. but it's just like a family. you know, if you've got to tighten your belts, you make some choices. now, here's the thing, though, and this is what the argument's about. we can't just close our deficit with spending cuts alone. because if we take that route, it means that seniors would have to pay a lot more for medicare. or students would have to pay a lot more for student loans. it means that laid-off workers might not be able to count on temporary assistance or training to help them get a new job. it means we'd have to make devastating cuts in education and medical research and clean energy research. just at a time when gas prices are killing people at the pump. so if we only did it with cuts, if we did not get any revenue to

help close this gap between how much money is coming in and how much money's going out, then a lot of ordinary people would be hurt, and the country as a whole would be hurt. and that doesn't make any sense. it's not fair. and that's why i've said if we're going to reduce our deficit, then the wealthiest americans and the biggest corporations should do their part as well. [applause] >> before we stop funding clean energy research, let's ask oil companies and corporate jet owners to give up the tax breaks that other companies don't get. [applause] i mean, these are special be tax

breaks. [applause] before we ask college students to pay more for their education, let's ask hedge fund managers to stop paying taxes that are lower on their rates than their secretaries. [applause] before we ask seniors to pay more for medicare, let's ask people like me to give up tax breaks that we don't need, and we weren't even asking for. prison -- [applause] look, i want everybody in america to do well. i want everybody to have a chance to become a millionaire. i think the free market system is the greatest wealth generator we've ever known. this isn't about punishing

wealth, this is about asking people who have benefited the most over the last decade to share in the sacrifice. [applause] and i think -- i think these patriotic americans are willing to pitch in if they're asked because they know that middle class families shouldn't have to pick up the whole tab for closing the deficit. so this idea of balance, this idea of shared sacrifice, of a deficit plan that includes tough spending cuts but also includes tax reform that raises more revenue, this isn't just my position, this isn't just the democratic position, this isn't some wild-eyed socialist position. [laughter] this is a position that's being taken by people of both parties and no party. it's a position taken by warren buffett, somebody who knows about business and knows a

little something about being wealthy. [laughter] it's a position that's been taken by every democratic and republican president who have signed major deficit deals in the past from ronald reagan to bill clinton. and i was pleased to see this week that it's a position taken by democrats and republicans in the senate. so we can pass a balanced plan like this. it's not going to make everybody happy. in fact, it'll make everybody somewhat happy. the easiest thing for a politician to do is to give you more stuff and ask less in return. it's a lot harder to say we've got to cut back on what you're getting, and you've got to pay a little more. that's, that's never fun. but we can do it in a balanced way that doesn't hurt anybody badly, that doesn't put the burden just on one group. so we can solve our deficit problem, and i'm willing to sign

a plan that includes tough choices i would not normally make, and there are a lot of democrats and republicans in congress who i believe are willing to do the same thing. the only people we have left to convince are some folks in the house of representatives. we're going to keep on working on that. [laughter] because i still believe we can do what you sent us here to do. in the 2010 americans chose a divided government, but they didn't choose a dysfunctional government. [applause] so there will be time for political campaigning, but right now this debate shouldn't be about putting on, you know, scoring political points. it should be about doing what's right for the country, for everybody. you expect us to work together, you expect us to compromise, you've all been working hard,

you've been doing whatever you have to do in order to get by and raise your families. you're meeting your responsibilities. so it's time for those of us in washington to do the same thing, and i intend to make that happen in the coming days, so thank you, everybody. [applause] let's take your questions. all right. so the way this works is you put up your a hand, and i call on you. [laughter] but i am going to go girl, boy, girl, boy to make sure that it's even and fair. [laughter] all right? i'm going to start with you right there. yes. hold on, we've got a mic here so -- and introduce yourself, if you don't mind. >> hello, mr. president. >> hi. >> my name is amanda, and i'm a big fan, i'm from iowa originally. >> nice. >> yes. [laughter]

i'm an atheist, and in dangerousville, ohio, in 2008 you asserted that no organization receiving taxpayer funds would be able to discriminate in hiring or firing based on a person's religion. however, you have not rescinded the executive order that permits this type of discrimination. in a time of economic hardship when it's difficult for a person to get a job based on her skills, what would you say to a woman who has been denied employment because of her religion or lack of religious beliefs by a taxpayer-funded organization? >> well, this is a very difficult issue, but a more narrow one than i think might be implied. it's very straightforward that people shouldn't be discriminated against for race, gender, sexual orientation and/or religious affiliation. what has happened is that there

has been a carve outdating back to president clinton's presidency. for religious organizations in their hiring for particular purposes. and this is always a tricky part of the first amendment. on the one hand, the first amendment insures that there's freedom of religion. on the other hand, we want to make sure that religious bodies are abiding by general laws. and so where this issue has come up is in fairly narrow circumstances where, for example, you've got a faith-based organization that's providing certain services they consider part of their mission to be promoting their religious views, but they may have a daycare center associated with the organization, or they may be

running a food pantry. and o so then the question is does a jewish organization have to hire a non-jewish person as part of that organization? is -- now, i think that the balance we've tried to strike is to say that if you are offering, if you have set up a nonprofit that is dissociated from your core religious functions and is out there in the public doing all kinds of work, then you have to abide generally with the nondiscrimination hiring practices. if, on the other hand, it is closer to your core funks as a synagogue or a mosque -- core functions as a synagogue or a mosque or a church, then there may be more leeway for you to hire somebody who is a believer of that particular religious

faith. it doesn't satisfy everybody, i will tell you that a lot of faith-based organization os think that we are too restrictive in how we define those issues. there are others like you, obviously, who think that we're not restrictive enough. um, i think we've struck the right balance so far, but this is something that we continue to be in dialogue with faith-based organization about to try to make sure that their hiring practices are as open and inclusive as possible. okay? thank you. yes, sir. back here. hold on a second, we've got a mic. jenna: the president holding a town hall meeting today on the same day he said weeks earlier that we'd have to have some sort of agreement on the debt ceiling in order to get something through congress so that we don't default on august 2nd. again, this happening at the university of maryland. we expect it to go on for about another hour or so, he's going to be fielding questions from the audience. you can check out the town hall on foxnews.com, we have it streaming live for you.

there was a little news that came in from congress, and we want to share that with you. the senate is going to be out for this weekend. previously, we understood it from senate majority leader harry reid that he was going to keep the senators there to keep working on a deal, if possible. the house is not going to be in session. but now the senator, senator reid saying that because of some sort of deal he hears happening with the white house and the house of representatives, he's letting the senators go. this is interesting because john boehner, the speaker of the house, has said in this morning: there's never been an agreement and, frankly, we're not close to an agreement. so the truth is out there somewhere, maybe between those two points of view. we're working hard to get the truth for you, the facts on whether or not there's any sort of agreement coming together on the debt ceiling, number one, and any sort of long-term package on overall debt reduction for this country. we'll keep you up-to-date as we hear more. rick: in the meantime, a fox news alert, and we continue to get new information about that

bomb blast in oslo, norway. we are getting confirmation now from the police in the oslo that it was, in fact, a bomb that caused the damage and destruction that you see on the screen there. a blast that occurred right near the office of the prime minister who we are told is safe. but there is one person who's dead, greg burke is streaming live with brand new information for us. greg, what are you hearing? >> reporter: rick, that's right. well, just a couple hours ago a chaotic scene there in oslo, norway, normally a pretty quiet town, and absolute mayhem there. several people injured, and as we are hearing, at least one dead because of this bomb, and that was the important news that you mentioned just coming out in the last few minutes. police are saying it was, in fact, a bomb. there was some hope, i think, at the beginning that there had been a gas explosion or something of the sort, but it does not seem to be the case. on market street in downtown oslo, right in the area of several government offices. you mentioned the prime minister he is, apparently, safe, but they say the 17-story building

that he was in, glass blown out several, several stories up. so what could have happened? nobody taking responsibility as of just yet, but you have to keep in mind that norway is taking part in libya, they're taking part in afghanistan, they also -- like their scandinavian neighbor denmark -- did have an uproar over the cartoons. but an uproar that i should mention that the norwegian government went out of it way to apologize for. so, basically, it's normally seen as a soft target because it's a peaceful country and considered that. one more thing, rick, you know, it's interesting that the actual nobel prize for peace is given out in oslo, but today it seems very far from that. rick? rick: good observation there. greg burke streaming live for us from europe. thanks very much. jenna: back stateside, it's hot outside. at least 17 states have temperatures above 100 degrees, and more than 20 people have died this this brutal heat wave.

utility companies are struggling to keep the juice on in so many places. adam shapiro is in new york city's central park with more. hi, adam. >> reporter: hey, jenna, and it is so hot out here, i'm spritzing the atlantic ocean. i'm going to tell you not only how you can save money, but how you can make money, have the utility company pay you in a heat wave like this and keep your cool when we come back. no white jeans after labor day? what are you my grandmother? i'll rock white jeans whenever i want. and with tidelus bleach, they'll stay white. not whitish, not eggshell, not ecru... whatever that . white. that's my tide. what's yours? but i did.

they said i couldn't fight above my weight class. but i did. they said i couldn't get elected to congress. but i did. ♪ smetimes when we touch ha ha! millions of hits! [ male announc ] flick, stack, and move between active apps seamlessly. only on the new hp touchpad with webos. but it's our job to make them say sothing interesting. so how about this weekend we learn some new tricks of the trade... then break out our doing clothes and get rolling. let's use some paint that helps us get the job done in record time and makes a statement when we're finished. we're lowering the cost of a new favorite color. more saving. more doing. that's the power of the home depot. glidden premium paint has been rated a best buy, and you can only get it at the home depot.

jenna: and update for the latest out of norway today. the capitol city of oslo a huge bomb blast went off in the middle of the afternoon, end of the workday at the prime minister's office. you're seeing the remnants of what happened there, the after affects. we are trying to find out more information about what exactly caused it. police say a bomb went off, who planted the bomb, how it got there, crucial details about this. we are still working on for you. we do have a phoner with us, oscar is a free-lance journalist inside oslo, he ran to the scene after he heard this blast go off. oscar, i'd like you to start there. what did you hear this afternoon and what did you see when you got to the scene here? >> i was on my way home for the afternoon after finishing work and i heard a big explosion, which was far bigger and stronger than anything i've heard before while i was working in the middle east.

and what i saw was a lot of shattered glass, people were cut by the glass, ambulances were rushed, very much like what we had seen in other areas where such attacks have taken place. jenna: any record on what or who is pinne behind this? >> there hasn't been anyone who has claimed it yet as of such. there is here here about the car bomb, but that has not been confirmed yet. what we know is that the bomb went off in the government offices and exploded inside a canteen and there are people already confirmed dead. jenna: i'm seeing one news wire on this right now from a news agency inside the country saying at least one person is dead, and it's very vague as far as others injured. when you were down there by this building did you see the injuries that some folks had? >> i did see a few injuries, but not very serious ones.

there were people who came, their faces covered in blood, rushing from the scene, and they were taken care of by the local paramedics, and then treated on the facilities, but i couldn't get a look to see people who were severely injured or anything like that. there are people emerging here of people who have been very seriously injured. i'm afraid that is all we know so far. jenna: it seems like the numbers of those dead and injured are changing moment by moment. it's early evening there, in oslo, again we are hearing some reports that there could be people trapped in the building. are there emergency crews on scene? does it seem like they are still searching for people inside the building? >> yeah, that is very much my impression, ambulances are rushing back and forth all the time. of course this has never happened in norway before at any time, and so it's very much a news situation for most no nor t

norwegians, so i think this is a a challenge, but more information will emerge at evening continues. jenna: we'll continue to follow the developing story as we are taking a look at the debris here. oscar made a very interesting point, we have to remember when this happens to a city that has never experienced this before, the response efforts, all of that is new. the shock, we can only speculate, intense for the people of oslo right now. again, we are getting a lot of conflicting reports on deaths and injuries. we'll continue to keep you updated as best we can. oscar, so good to have him today, free-lance journalist from inside oslo. we'll continue to keep you updated as we hear more. rick: back home now a fox news weather alert, the brutal heatwave smothering a big chunk of the company doing a number on america's power grid. new york is expecting its first trip i will digit temperatures

of the season, and the power company expects usage to break the all time record. adam shapiro is live in central park. adam, how hot is it out there? >> reporter: rick, it is so hot? >> how hot is it? >> reporter: i saw two trees fighting over a dog. let's get down to the serious business here. conn edison is asking people to conserve electricity. you can make money having a roo tilt pay you if you're a commercial and industrial user to what they do peak shade, drop our electric usage and it works out to different plans, you can make 50 to a buck 50 to ever kilowatt you dropped out. if you're a guy like me and only have a air conditioner in an apartment how can you make money? joining me is a representative of the electricity program. >> we have a free programmable term owe stat.

you can regulate it by turning up the temperature when we have hot days like that. we will give you a free programmable thermostat plus a $25 gift as well. you can save a lot of money on your air conditioner use and we can help control the grid a lot better. >> reporter: you're saving roughly 30 megawatts. >> we can save 30 megawatts with all the customers we have enrolled. >> reporter: yesterday was the ninth highest usage day in conned history. 30 megawatts is a lot. that's just for 25,000 customers. you have 3 million in the metro area that conned supplies. also your cellphone charger, your ipad charger, tablet charger, all that stuff is draining from the grid. you unplug it you save money. want to make money, programmable thermostat, they get to control it when you're away. good news you can set it back

town when they are not looking. rick: adam shapiro thank you very much. jenna: the mystery widening in two deaths connect towed a san diego mansion. autopsies for most victims are complete but the results sealed to the public. we weren't sure if they would be sealed earlier this week, now we know they are. here is what we do now. a woman was found hanging from a balcony inside her boyfriend's mansion last week, her hands and feet were bound. her boyfriend's 6-year-old son max died sunday in a hospital. he had been injured when he fell down the stairs in the house. that fall happened two days before the girlfriend was found dead. adam housley is live in los angeles and he's been working this story all along. adam, what new information do we have about these deaths. >> reporter: you mentioned first of all that the autopsies had been sealed, that is a normal process in san diego county. they don't normally release autopsy results unless the family requests it. a lot of the autopsy results are private and personal matters. they are going to keep them

sealed and waiting for the toxicology reports to come back. that would normally be a six-week process. because of the nature of this case and so much interest really from around the globe they've expedited that process, and we're told those results could come back as early as the end of next week, but most likely the beginning of the following week. so that would still be three and a half, four weeks ahead of schedule. they have moved it up as a considerable paeudz. in the meantime the sh*er euf's department says they are not going to talk about anything, they are going to keep this case quiet, everyone is cooperating, they will continue to do their investigation. and people at home need to be patient because this is not like television when things are basically secure in a matter of hours in some cases, this thing takes some time. take a listen. >> what's important as an investigator is always to stand back, take your time with the investigation, you only have one time to get it right and make sure that you do. don't let the rumors change your investigation. do the investigation the way you would on any case.

>> reporter: and they are still calling this case, jenna, at least the death of the girlfriend, violent, bizarre, odd but they haven't yet called it a homicide. jenna: using that language but staying quiet all the same, the authorities are. what about the family, what are we hearing from them? >> reporter: we've heard from the victim's sister, we've heard from her the last few days in fact. yesterday they put down on paper that she doesn't believe her sister would have committed suicide. we know the family of the young boy, jonah shacknai is the father he went back to arizona to do funeral arrangements. i asked at this point has anyone caused any problems, they say everyone is cooperating fully. they believe they've contacted everybody at the mansion monday, tuesday and wednesday. the boy fell on monday and she was found hanged on wednesday. they've talked to everyone, they say everyone is cooperating at this hour, they are waiting for the results to come back and the investigation to continue. jenna: hopefully we'll get

answers soon. thank you very much for the information. more as we get it of course. rick: when we come back we'll have more on the debt debate and word from president obama at that town hall hearing that he has concluded along with his attorneys at the white house that he does not have the power under the 14th amendment to simply raise the debt limit on his own. more on that. and the latest on the explosion in oslo right near the office of the prime minister. one person dead. the preups we're told is safe, but who is responsiblprime mini. but who is responsible for this? breaking details when we come back.

diabetes testing? what else is new? you get the blood, hope it's enough, it's-- what's this? freestyle lite® blood glucose test strip. sure, i'll try it, but-- [beep] wow. yep, that's the patented freestyle zipwik™ design. it's like it-- [both] targets the blood. yeah, draws it right in. the test starts fast. you need just a third the blood of one touch.® okay. freestyle test strips. i'll take 'em. sure. call or click-- we'll send you strips and a meter, free. can't i just have these? freestyle lite test strips. call or click today.

rick: more information out of oslo where at least one bomb has gone off right in the heart of the capitol h-t there. and we are getting a statement from the police so far police are saying that the cause of the explosion not entirely clear, but there has been, according to police, one or several powerful explosions in the government district in oslo. one of those explosions going off right near the office of the

prime minister, who we are told is safe. but these are brand-new pictures coming in. you can see people there attending to one of the wounded. jenna, there are also reports in addition to one or possibly two people having been killed, people being injured and perhaps even people being still trapped in those buildings. >> we are hearing from a norway government official. again, as you mentioned, rick, these are government buildings at least targeted for whatever this was. we want to be careful with this. authorities have not come out and mentioned a word terror attack or any sort of group so we will not go with that right now. we can only speculate again on who did this. and what their intentions were, but you are seeing some of the after affects. brand-new pictures into our newsroom on this. now getting back to that norway government official, he says that there are still people trapped at the bomb site. it was in the middle of the afternoon on a friday workday, around 3:30 i believe local time when this happened. you can only imagine that people

were still in the office. rick: a little bit of context here, norway is grappling with a little home-grown terror plot linked to al-qaida, and there are two suspects in jail who are a waiting charges. again, we don't have any confirmation about who was responsible behind this terror attack in norway, but again there is this sort of simmering in norway, something that people are paying close attention to. terrorism has been a concerned in parts of europe. we'll have more on the story when we come right back on "happening now." or even 20 years? call imperial structured settlements. the experts at imperial can convert your long-term payout into a lump sum of cash today.

rick: let's get a little politics in here today. we are hearing a lot about a growing gop field for the 2012

race for the white house. also to take control of the house and senate and that landscape could change a bit. the gop controls the house 240 to 193, two vacancies and all seats are up in 2012. democrats control the senate 51-47 with new indianas who caucus with the democrats. two republicans are requiring from the senate. jon kyle and kate bailey hutch chin son. six are retiring at the end of the term and 17 running for rerehrebgs in the senate. 23 seats held by democrats will be up for grabs in 2012. larry sabado is director for the center of politics at university of virginia. always good to talk to you. thank you for being here. i was struck by a poll from abc news and "the washington post" who said that 70% of people who help ask said they would like to

fire their elected official in washington. that is a huge number. >> it is a huge number. and you wonder whether at some point we might actually have a fourth wave election in a row. what is a wave election? it's where lots of incumbents get tossed out, all though the eupl kupl pwapbts can be heavily concentrated in one party. remember we had a wave election in 2006 that was democratic. another wave election tilted to the democrats. 2010 a big wave election for the republicans. could we really be having a fourth wave election? it's too soon to say and the presidential nomination will be very important. rick: if there is one of these wave rehrebgss that you're referring to who stands to benefit the most, republicans or democrats? >> well let's take the house first. the democrats would have to gain 24 house seats. it doesn't sound like many, remember the republicans against 62 house seats in 2012. but 24 is actually a big number

if you look at the basics. this is a year that is including redistricting, it's a presidential election year, there are a lot of factors involved. the interesting thing is that if president obama is reelected, suppose he gets a second term, you might say, well would he have coattails to bring in enough democrats to take control? look at history. when you've had presidents nixon, and reagan, and bush, and also clinton reelected, they didn't come anywhere close to winning anything close to 24 seats. they would care carry 3 to 16 ss for their party. it's actually really tough for a party to get 24 seats in a presidential re-election year. rick: i was struck by the president's comments in maryland at the town hall that he's holding right now saying that this debt debate that is being played out in the nation's

capitol should not be about scoring political points. that's what he said to the crowd at the university of maryland. what do you think the way that both sides are handling -- the various fractions within each side are handling this debate? who is winning the battle so far politically? >> people ask me that all the time, rick and i say it doesn't matter who looks good right now. makes no difference at all. what is going to matter is what is the result? what comes out of this? what deal is struck? and i think some deal will be struck eventually. that's what's going to determine opinion that might affect the election, although i still say it's jobs, it's overall economic growth, that's what is really important for the election, not the debt deal, unless they really upset some particular party or political faction. rick: spent some time on your website this morning, a lot of great analysis.

larry sabado is director for the center of politics at the university of virginia. thank you very much sir. jenna: more live pictures from oslo, norway, where you're seeing the after effects of a bomb blast at a government building. it happened just about two hours ago. there is the emergency crew on the scene, and we understand, according to one government official talking to the bbc that there are still people trapped inside this particular building. we are hearing reports of those dead, some people injured, some people trapped as we mentioned. another norwegian official saying this is the worst situation his country has ever seen. this has never happened in the capitol of norway, it's never happened in the country. we don't know what caused it precisely. we know a bomb went off, we don't know what kind, what exactly happened here and we don't know who is responsible. we are working on details and live reports and brand-new video into our newsroom coming up after the break. can i have some ice cream, please ? no, it's just for new people.

hey ! chocolate, vanilla or strawberry ? chocolate ! chocolate it is ! yeah, but i'm new, too. umm... he's new... er... than you. even kids know it's wrong to treat new frien better than old friends. at ally bank, we treat all our customers fairly, with no teaser rates and no minimum deposit to open. it's just the right thing to do.

but for some of us with overactive bladder,

our pipes just don't work as well as they should. sometimes, i worry my pipes might leak. but i learned there's something more i can do. now, i take care with vesicare. once-daily vesicare can help control your bladder muscle and is proven to treat overactive bladder with symptoms of frequent urges and leaks day and night. if you have certain stomach or glaucoma problems, or trouble emptying your bladder, do not take vesicare. vesicare may cause allergic reactions that may be serious. if you experience swelling of the face, lips, throat or tongue, stop taking vesicare and get emergency help. tell your doctor right away if you have severe abdominal pain, or become constipated for three or more days. vesicare may cause blurred vision, so use caution while driving or doing unsafe tasks. common side effects are dry mouth, constipation, and indigestion. so why wait ? ask your doctor today... ... about taking care with vesicare.

jenna: a fox news alert as we hit high noon here on the east coast on a friday. new reports that an explosion happened in norway's capital city of oslo. we are getting confirmation that it was a bomb or maybe more than one bomb that caused this explosion. we're hearing again unconfirmed reports of people dead, several injured and maybe others trapped. the blast carrying through a number of buildings including one that houses the prime minister's office. we have confirmed through media reports in norway that he is safe, he was working from home, apparently, according to these reports. but now we're also hearing, as i mentioned, that this may not be over. not only may there be people trapped in this bomb site, but there may be other bombs as well. greg burke is streaming live from rome with the very latest. greg? >> >> reporter: hi, jenna, that's right. well, the big news coming in just the last half hour. in the last half hour, the

police confirmation that it was, in fact, a bomb. it wasn't a gas explosion, it wasn't just an accident. also the thing you mentioned that there may be some people trapped here, obviously, that did not look like the case with those initial images we saw, it looked like they'd done pretty much the cleanup. that really is the latest. at least one person dead, there could be more. there are certainly several injured, and you can see from the amount of destruction how much glass came out of those windows. the prime minister's building is supposedly 17 stories high, and you can see how much of that was damaged, certainly people on the street and perhaps even in the buildings were injured. now, why did all this happen? a lot of different theories. just last week a norwegian prosecutor filed terror charges against an iraqi cleric who had threatened norwegians with death if they deported him. also norway had a similar incident to what denmark had with the cartoons that the muslims found offensive, and also two other things very simple.

one afghanistan, one is called libya. the norwegian troops in both places. and finally, jenna, it's too early to tell, of course, who is behind this. this is just speculation. we are waiting for some claim of responsibility. we're also waiting for a news conference from police where at least we can get some of the basics here to find out what kind of bomb it was and, as you say, unclear right now whether it was one bomb or more. jenna? jenna: back to greg burke as we get more. brand new details by way of the associated press, and as you can understand it, the wires and reports changing minute by minute. but the associated press reporting that two people are confirmed dead by police in norway, 15 injured. more information as we get it. in the meantime, president obama's holding a town hall calling for a balanced approach to reduce the deficit, the debt, the debt ceiling. we've got a lot to cover here today. rick: well said, jenna, that's

not easy. jenna: hi, everybody, i'm jenna lee. rick: and i'm rick folbaum if in for jon. the amount of money the government needs to borrow, what has washington tied up in knots. jenna: the president earlier calling this an opportunity for both parties to come together. >> so this idea of balance, this idea of shared sacrifice, of a deficit plan that includes tough spending cuts but also includes tax reform that raises more revenue, this isn't just my position, this isn't just a democratic position, this isn't some wild-eyed socialist position. [laughter] this is a position that's being taken by people of both parties and no party. jenna: tempers still flaring along partisan lines back at the capital. here's dan coats on the floor of the senate lashing out at majority leader harry reid a little earlier this morning. >> >> i guess we're all getting frustrated. it's 100 and some degrees heat

index outside, and i can understand people getting worked up about all this sort of thing. but the future of america's at stake, and this majority leader is not allowing us to deal with it. jenna: at least they have air-conditioning on the inside. senator cornyn can confirm that for us, he's a texas senator, a republican on the budget committee. it is certainly hot down there in d.c., senator, and you have a hot topic on your hands here. after senator coats made those comments, the proposal by the house that the cut, cap balance plan as part of a debt reduction deal, basically, got stopped in its tracks. i'm stuttering because there's some legislative procedures, but it's not going anywhere. that's how we know it. the majority leader said y'all can go home this weekend, heath not holding any sessions. so what's next? is. >> well, if anything proves washington's addiction to spending borrowed money, it's the failure of this very reasonable cut, cap and balance piece of legislation that was passed by the house by a

bipartisan vote, and it came to the senate and was killed along party lines by our democratic friends. so you have to ask who is being responsible and serious in trying to come up with a proposal be. the house has passed a budget, the senate hasn't passed a budget in over 800 days. the president himself has no plan, but rather prefers to lecture others about their responsibilities when not taking responsibility himself. so the time is clicking, time is ticking down to august the 2nd, and i hope we can come up with a reasonable way to avoid default, to avoid tax increases during a fragile economic recovery and be avoid a smoke and mirrors sort of washington solution that would demonstrate washington as business as usual. jenna: you mentioned the lack of plans out there, you mentioned the plan coming from republicans in the house, but, again, moving past some of these talking points and the democrats say they have, they are negotiating, they are working on it.

but that being what it is, they may not come up with a plan. and we're still reaching that deadline. so do you have a back-up plan? do the republicans have another proposal willing to -- being brought forward here so that we don't default? >> well, i think the most reasonable short-term solution would be for the house to pass a bill to take the cuts that the bide b negotiations -- biden negotiations have produced, to pass a short-term debt ceiling bill and to avoid default. and to allow more time to work on the details of a more comprehensive solution. but really what it boils down to is what can pass in the house. we hear rumors that speaker baner and the president are negotiating a big deal. i'm very interested, we're all interested in what's being negotiated, but we haven't seen it, so we don't know much about it. jenna: what are you hearing about it though? you must be talking about it amongst your peers. are you hearing any details about what could be happening? is. >> the only thing we're hearing, and again, this is just what

we're reading and hearing in the halls of congress is maybe $3 trillion worth of cuts along with no tax increases now, but the hope of tax reform with increased revenue that would come from economic growth. that's the kind of revenue that we believe in, republicans do, which is from growing the economy and putting people back to work. but right now all we're left with is a bunch of negotiations behind closed doors, and we'd like to get something out in the light of day to be able to examine it. jenna: sir, i don't want to get too perm, your weekend plans are your weekend plans, but now that there's not any sessions happening, what are you going to do? are you waiting around washington to see if anything happens? >> >> i'm going to texas this afternoon. i can't wait to get back home to where people show some common sense. in all seriousness, this was kind of a more theater than anything else. harry reid said we're going to stay in until the deadline and work.

well, we know where most of the work is being done right now, and that is by the house of representatives. and a very reasonable proposal, this cut, cap and balance bill being kill inside the senate along party lines. so we hope that the negotiations between speaker boehner and the president bear some fruit. absent that, the house is going to have to pass a bill for a temporary fix, get it over to the senate so we can pass it, get it to the president by the deadline. jenna: just really quickly on the temporary fix because you mentioned you'd be for that considering the timeline we're in, when we talk about an extension to get some further debt talks happening, i've heard six months would be the extension before anything would really have to happen? is that what you're hearing as well? would you be comfortable to pass a debt ceiling raise but then wait another six months before we have some sort of debt plan in if place? is. >> well, the aggravating thing about this is that the same issues come back in six months or two months or whenever the can is kicked down the road. we have to solve this problem, and it's not just a negotiation

between republicans and democrats, we have credit rating agencies that are threatening to downgrade the quality of our debt which costs more money. and just a 1% increase in the amount we have to pay to get people to buy that debt is $1.3 trillion over ten years. that could wipe out any savings that we're able to make. so this is a very serious and urgent matter, and be i hope we're able to come to a comprehensive solution here before august the 2nd, not just kick the can down the road. jenna: and even with a temporary raise, even with some sort of debt plan in place, that downgrade could be coming anyways if those rating companies are not happy with what the government does. >> that's a real concern. jenna: senator cornyn, we appreciate you sticking around to talk to us, and we look forward to talking to you again soon. >> thank you very much. rick: so we have heard from the president on what he wants from congress, but new exclusive details that fox business is getting about a possible deal, the one we've been talking about, perhaps being worked out between the speaker of the house, john boehner, and the

white house. peter barnes is live in washington, and, peter, we just heard from the senator that he hopes the talks between these two sides bears fruit, but i understand you're also learning it could bear some gimmicks in order to achieve the level of savings that we've heard about. >> reporter: that's right, rick. we just heard senator cornyn talk about the $3 trillion, that number came out of nowhere kind of yesterday, the day before and got a lot of senators and a lot of reporters running around saying, oh, my gosh, the president and the speaker are talking about a $3 trillion package of deficit reduction here. well, now we've learned from sources close to the negotiations that they are getting to this big headline number by including the winddown of the wars in iraq and afghanistan which, frankly, everybody in town has already counted for other savings, had previously counted as savings in the budget outside of these discussions and outside of a new round of spend being cuts. so if we look now at where this

package might end up and how they might get to three trillion, you see right there they assume, they include now this trillion dollars in savings in ending the wars in if iraq and afghanistan. the real cuts would probably come through about a trillion dollars in discretionary spending over the next ten years, some changes in social security and how they calculate inflation for increasing social security checks year-over-year, some interest savings which are also, by the way, assumed and then some others. if you add that all up, you get to a nice big headline number, $3 trillion. rick: and certainly, as you said, getting a lot of attention. we just heard the president in maryland say that he is in favor of doing something that's very unpopular within his party which is to make cuts to entitlement programs that a lot of americans enjoy and some rely on. but upon closer inspection where are the savings coming when we talk about the entitlement programs like social security and medicare? are there any real savings there?

>> reporter: no. sources say that the savings would be modest in this deal that the president and speaker boehner are working on. there might be two or three hundred billion over ten years in medicare and medicaid savings by making tweaks and changes here, getting rid of the old waste, fraud and abuse that you always hear ability, and then changing the formula for social security checks might save two or three hundred billion, but major entitlement reform would be left for later. rick: exclusive information from peter barnes of the fox business network. peter, good work. thanks very much. >> reporter: thanks, rick. jenna: bringing you back overseas, another fox news alert. we have confirmed that two people are dead in that bomb blast in norway that happened just a few hours ago. at least 15 others are injured, and again we're hearing reports at this time that others are still trapped inside, again, these government offices that were targeted by who we don't know. here's another report we're getting right now. oslo police say the office of one broadcast tv station has

been sealed off because of a suspicious package. more details on this breaking story in the oslo right after the break. my cream is what makes stouffer's fettuccini alfredo so delicious. i think you'll find it's the vegetables. deliciously rich. flavorful! [ female announcer ] together at last. introducing new stouffer's farmers' harvest with sides of lightly sauteed farm-picked vegetables. find more ways to get to the table at letsfixdinner.com. whose non-stop day starts with back pain... and a choice. take advil no and maybe up to four in a day. or choose aleve and two pills for a day free of pain. way to go, coach. ♪

[ male announcer get ready for e left lane. the volkswagen autobahn for all event is back. right now, get a great deal on new volkswagen models, including the jetta, awarded a top safety pick by the iihs. that's the power of german engineering. hurry in and lease the jetta s for just $179 a month. ♪ visit vwdealer.com today. with diabetes, it's tough to keep life balanced. i don't always have time to eat like i should. and the more i focus on everything else, the less time i have to take care of me. that's why i like glucerna shakes. they have slowly digestible carbs to help minimize blood sugar spikes, which can help ler a1c. glucerna products help me keep everything balanced. [ golf ubs clanking ] [ husband ] i'm good! well, almost everything. [ male announcer ] glucerna. delicious shakes and bars. helping people with diabetes find balance.

rick: well, an uproar over tax cuts, tax hikes and a pledge. the president of americans for tax reform, grover norquist, writing in today's new york times about remarks he made this washington post. he was discussing the taxpayer protection pledge, and since 1986 grover norquist's group has been asking politicians, republicans and be democrats alike, to sign the pledge to oppose and vote against any tax increases. here's norquist talking about this with "the washington post" editorial writer ruth mar cuts. >> not continuing a tax cut is not technically a tax increase. >> so it does not violate the pledge? rick: norquist was asked if letting the bush era tax cuts

expire would constitute a tax hike, and that's what he was answering there. marcus later jumping all over the statement saying to the extent he has terrorized scores of republican lawmakers against being willing to allow the bush tax cuts, any part of them, to lapse, norquist's comments offer them a huge amount of wiggle room. grover norquist is joining us now from washington. what did you mean to say, sir, when it comes to the expiration or allowing the bush era tax cuts to expire? would that be breaking your pledge? >> okay. right now the present policy are the bush '01-'3 tax cuts, the amt patch. that's present policy. changing that in a way to raise revenue would be raising taxes, and that's the challenge for people who want to make those, to make that decision. i got wrapped around a bunch of hypotheticals in the conversation there, but i want

to be very clear. raising taxes to raise additional revenue, um, would violate the pledge. what we've been clear, and one way to check on this, ending the bush tax rate reductions, the present policy, would increase the tax burden by $4 trillion over the next decade. that is a massive tax increase, and it doesn't pass the laugh test which is something i said repeatedly. it doesn't pass the laugh test as not a tax increase. can you get into hypotheticals where congress goes home and attacks cuts all by its lonesome? yeah, i suppose you could, and the martians could come down too. in reality we're talking about congressmen and senators taking some of the bush tax cut and spending it. that's a tax increase. rick: so when you said that you would not, you would not look at a lawmaker voting to allow the expiration of the bush tax cuts as being in violation of your

pledge, you were not giving them any wiggle room, or were you trying to send some kind of a message to republicans that it's okay if you go out and do this? >> no. most clearly. and, again, mr. boehner and mr. -- leader mcconnell have always been very clear that they're not going to support any tax increase and insist that we continue present policy on not just the bush tax cuts, but also the amt patch and some of these others. other tax increases that might lapse from time to time because of senate rules. so let me be very clear: when congress gets together and votes to raise taxes, it's a tax increase. if congress gets together and passes some big deal and when you disaggregate it taxes are higher, it's a tax increase. i'm sorry i was not clear, i wrote a new york time piece trying to be clear, actually sort of four different attacks

on the pledge that have showed up in the last year, and i respond to all of them. we only have 800 words. i'm trying to be clear here -- [inaudible conversations] rick: i read it as well, but i just want to, i want to ask you about because we're hearing about reforming the tax code, we're hearing about closing loopholes. is closing loopholes or taking tax breaks away from big corporations like the oil companies, for example, is that breaking your pledge? >> okay. you have to look -- when you get into hypotheticals, you have to look at the entire package. i would support the, the republican party and the pledge would support tax reform where deductions in credits that have outlasted their usefulness are eliminated and rates, tax rates are reduced. if at the end of that process the tax burden is the same, it's just fewer deductions in credits and lower rates. that's tax reform. if at the end of that process with 100 different moving parts taxes are higher, that's not tax

reform, that's a tax increase. that would violate the pledge. so there's nothing about the pledge that defends any particular tax deduction or credit. i'm not wedded to any of them, no member of congress is. if you get rid of it, though, cut taxes elsewhere so you're not hiding a tax increase inside what you call tax reform. rick: real quickly because politicians love to pass these sort of temporary deals, you know, the bush era tax cuts were only supposed to last for a certain amount of time and then expire, but now we get into a point where letting them expire is a tax hike. what do you say to lawmakers in washington who might right now be talking about some kind of a temporary deal as we live with this sort of debt debate that's going on? >> okay. temporary can be a problem, it can be better than nothing. um, we need to make sure that the present lower taxes of the '01 and '03 bush tax cuts continue, that the amt patch is

made permanent. if you can do that two years out, four years out permanent, those are all steps in the right direction. rick: got it. grover norquist, we've got to end it there, i'm sorry, because of the breaking news overseas. we appreciate you coming on. leg we'll have breaking news out of norway when we come right back. . the experts at imperial can convert your long-term payout into a lump sum of cash today. a network of possibilities. in here, the planned combination of at&t and t-mobile would deliver our next generation mobile broadband experience to 55 million more amecans, many in small towns and rural communities, giving them a new choice. we'll deliver better service,

with thousands of new cell sites... f greater access to all the things you want, whenever you want them. it's the at&t network... and what's possible in here is almost impossible to say. thought they were dead. [ laughter ] [ grunting ] huh? [ male announcer ] should've used roundup. america's number one weed killer.

it kills weeds to the root, so they don't come back. guaranteed. weeds won't play dead, they'll stay dead. roundup. no root. no weed. no problem.

this is the first time this has ever happened in oslo, norway, and although we hear speculation about terrorism, we had yet to hear anything official from the authorities, but that is the case here. oftentimes this city of about four and a half million people, we do get conflicting reports, so we'll continue to work on this story, give you the latest details. again, two headlines. you have the summer camp outside the city according to reports being attacked by a gunman, a man dressed as a policeman, and can then this bomb blast that went off outside government buildings. we'll give you more information as we get it.

rick: try to work a little good news in, shall we? the right now football, perhaps, is moving closer to moving on job to a field in time for the season to begin later on in the summer. nfl owners voting to approve an agreement that would end the four month lockout, but it may be too soon to start rooting for your favorite -- well, you can always root for your favorite team. too soon for scenes like this to be playing out was the players -- because the players have yet to sign off. jonathan serrie is in atlanta with the latest on the negotiations. jonathan? >> reporter: hey, rick. it's one of of those glass half full/glass half empty situations. the lockout continues despite a strong 31-0 vote by the nfl owners to approve a deal last night. now, under the terms of the owners' agreement players would be allowed back into club facilities for voluntary workouts starting saturday. the new league year and free agency signings would begin on friday. listen.

>> i think we've crafted a long-term agreement that can be good for the game of football, be good for the players, be good for the clubs and mostly, importantly, good for our game. and for our fans. >> reporter: but the players have yet to approve the deal. in an e-mail the team representatives, nfl players' association director maurice smith writes, quote, issues that need to be collectively bargained remain open. other issues such as worker's compensation, economic issues and be end of deal terms remain unresolved. there is no agreement between the nfl and the players at this time. that's what he writes in this e-mail. now, in addition to issues of pay and benefits, players would also have to dismiss lawsuits that they have filed against the nfl before any deal is signed by both parties. they also would have to reinstate their union before signing any collective bargaining deal.

there's a debate going on right now between the players and the owners as to just how much time the players need to reconstitute that union, and it's already taking a toll on the preseason schedule. there was a hall of fame game that had been scheduled to be played on august 7th. the nfl announced yesterday that game has been canceled due to delays in the ongoing negotiations. rick? rick: all right. jonathan serrie, let's get it done, guys, and go eagles. [laughter] jonathan, thank you very much. jenna: you had to get that in, didn't you? rick: of course! jenna: he loves the eagles. rick: my boys. jenna: cash flow a struggle on capitol hill with major ripple effects for each of us. what would happen if worst case scenario plays out, the country defaults and the government can't pay its bills. what would happen? we've heard a lot of scenarios. plus, new polls show governor perry surging, why he's

playing coy about running for president. >> why have you changed your mind? >> um, i didn't say i was running, did i? >> no. >> okay. i was just checking. yeah. i'm going to think about it. hey, the new guy is loaded with protein! really? 25 grams of protein. what do we have? all four of us, together? 24. he's low fat, too, and has 5 grams of sugars. i'll believe it when i--- [ both ] oooooh... what's shakin'? [ female announcer ] as you get older, protein is an important part of staying active and strong.

new ensure high protein... fifty percent of your daily value of protein. low fat and five grams of sugars. see? he's a good egg. [ major nutrition ] new ensure hh protein. ensure! nutrition in charge!

rick: well, he's not even running, at least not yet, but texas governor rick perry is picking up steam in the republican race for the presidency. perry running second behind mitt

romney in the latest fox news poll with 14%. wow. a.b. stoddard is an associate editor for "the hill," he's in shouting distance and hasn't even announced his candidacy. what's going on? >> well, this is still an unsettled field. mitt romney has some liabilities, he is not in a position of strength at this point. there's still republican voters in the primary electorate looking at this field and looking for other options, and you can see that as michele bachmann surges, congresswoman from minnesota, and you see all this interest still generating, um, for rudy giuliani to get in, sarah palin to get in and, of course, governor rick perry of texas. i think he's in, i just think he's getting his ducks in a row. rick: he's in, you think. is he a game changer? >> oh, yeah. rick: once he announces, does he knock romney off of that perch at the top or what? >> everybody in the field is nervous about rick perry

entering the race. it is a problem for bachmann, for romney and for pawlenty. it is a real problem for anyone who's trying to make a play in iowa. he is, rick perry enjoys strong support from the tea party movement, and he has some establishment support that's beginning the grow. it's, he's certainly not the establishment choice, but there are still major donors sitting on the sidelines who have not given to mitt romney who are looking for someone else, and some of them, some of them have begun to talk to rick perry. it looks like he would be able to bridge these two universes within the tea party and the establishment, and that's a threat to any candidate in the field. rick: i was doing a little research ahead of our talk today, a.b., and be i found he does not have universal support within the tea party. in fact, there are a lot of tea party members down in texas who have been circulating information letting people know, first of all, that rick perry worked for al gore's presidential campaign in 1988, and so he is a recent convert or at least a somewhat recent

convert to the republican party. they also point out that he signed a law making texas the first state to offer in-state tuition to illegal immigrants and that he blasted a proposed border fence as, quote, idiocy. again, not the stuff that tea party folks like to hear. >> well, he has come lately to the tea party cause, and he has strong support with many tea party groups. he will certainly have his record under tremendous scrutiny, and it is true that while he was governor of texas spending did go up, adjusted for inflation and population worse than the record of george w. bush as governor of texas, and that record was criticized by democrats when he was running for president. so it is not, everyone is going to take their arrows, and rick perry's record is not perfect be. but at this point he enjoys enough tea party support that candidates like michele bachmann are nervous about him get anything the race. he's already quite popular, and

he hasn't even established himself as a real candidate. everyone gets a lot of looking over, and then they have trouble after, um, their campaign, you know, truly begins, so he will also have a long campaign where he will be challenged, and he could make mistakes, and his record will be scrutinized. but there's still this hunger for someone else to come in, and that's why he has this opening. rick: and, you know, as we've seen this week with michele bachmann and the stories about her problems with migraine headaches, the higher someone rises in the polls, the more scrutiny they face. >> that's right. rick: folks out there want to knock them off. a.b. stoddard, thanks so much. >> thank you. jenna: well, the federal reserve and u.s. treasury are working out what to do and which bills to pay in case lawmakers fail to raise the debt ceiling. if u.s. does default on its debt or fail to pay its bills, the

consequences, well, they've been described a whole bunch of different ways. james rosen, we've heard dire, armageddon, chaos, and we've also heard may not be that bad. >> reporter: no one is using the word sugary, we should point that out. through the eyes of president obama and be what happens if he and lawmakers fail to raise the debt ceiling before august 2nd. as the president surveyed, what the country is taking in and bills it's paying out, he could face a slew of agonizing decisions. first, the revenue side. treasury data from august 2009 and '10 was used to project what uncle sam will take in next month, about $203 billion for the month. but let's look at what we have to pay out, about $100 billion gets gobbled up by medicare, medicaid and social security. another $60 billion roughly would take care of the people who do business with the pentagon and the interest we owe

on our debt. but you've also got federal salaries and benefits, about 15 billion. how about a helping hand to the 14 million unemployed people out there? tuition money, temporary assistance for needy families, paychecks for our active duty soldiers, veterans' programs, that's about six billion for the month, and can then there's irs refunds. in all the federal government will face a shortfall just for the month of august of about $160 billion. so what will we likely pay first? the experts tell us interest on our debt and then social security. >> in this country, generally, we pay all of our bills and we pay them in the order in which they're due, there's a possibility that that social security payment would not be paid on the 3rd, but it would be paid on the 4th or 5th. it would be paid. >> reporter: now, it's conceivable they could punt these decisions to congress starting on august 3rd, but president obama and treasury secretary tim geithner will

likely make these decisions themselves. if there is no deal struck, august will prove, as jay powell told us, impossibly difficult for the nation's chief executive. jenna? jenna: maybe that's the phrase we'll use right now. james, thank you so much. the truth about the default and more as we get it. james rosen in d.c. more on that breaking news out of europe as well. bomb blast in oslo, we hear about an attack at a summer camp, a separate attack outside of the capital city. information coming in to our newsroom and also at foxnews.com. check it out during the break check it out during the break for all of the top stories. we'll be right back with more. . new citracal slow release... continuously releases calcium plus d for the efficient absorption my body needs. citracal. time to mix it up with new philly cooking creme. it'll make your chicken creamier, dreamier, with lot flavor. spread the love in four fabulous flavors.

spoon in a little new philly cooking creme.

jenna: a fox news alert as we bring you up-to-date about what happened now in oslo. oslo, the capital city of norway, trying to recover right now, again, reports of a rescue attempt still happening inside the capital city after a bomb blast at a government building there. also new reports in to our newsroom about a gunman that went out into a summer camp

posing as a police officer with a handgun and opened fire. we have no more additional information on that attack. apparently, well, here's this one small detail. it's not confirmed yet, but it's from our sister network, sky news, saying that this man who opened fire opened fire at a labor party youth camp on an island outside of oslo, and, again, there could be a connection here. and i mentioned that part about the youth camp because government buildings were targeted, and now if this summer camp proves to have any connections to the government, well, we could only speculate what that would mean. neil livingston is joining us by the phone to give us his take on what little details we have right now, neil, about this. no government official is calling this a terror attack right now inside of norway as i know it. that could change any moment. does it have the characteristics of a terror attack? >> well, jenna, it certainly does have the characteristics of a terrorist attack.

it appears to be a car bomb attack in down on the oslo, and if this second attack is linked in the any way to the first attack, certainly that would suggest a coordinated terrorist type of action. now, norway has no domestic terrorist groups that we know of, so more than likely -- and we don't have all the facts -- but this is probably middle east terrorism. jenna: some initial details, again according to reports from sky news, about the attack at the summer camp, the images on our screen have to do with the bomb blast in the city area of oslo. we're getting reports now that as many as four people may have been shot and killed at this youth camp. um, neil, talk to us a little bit about coordinated attacks and what happens as police are trying to work to find out more details about who's behind this. >> well, first of all, coordinated attacks are something that terrorist groups like to do because while the

authorities are distracted on the first attack, often they let down their guard, and they can carry out secondary and tertiary attacks. and that's also very typical of al-qaeda and a variety of other terrorist groups. so, again, without all the facts in, the finger of suspicion would suggest that this is probably middle eastern in its origin. norway is involved right now both in afghanistan and in libya, and it has a large muslim population, about 3% of its population, and there have been tensions in recent years. and there have been a number of terrorist plots that have been uncovered in the country and have been preempted. jenna: that's an interesting final detail that you add there about preempted attacks. again, we don't have any official word from the government calling this a terror attack, but i am seeing one report from the associated press that local police in oslo are sending anti-terror police to this youth camp in question

following the reports of a shooting. and, apparently, the youth camp is on an island, so we can only, again, speculate on the challenges to try to get there. is this live pictures, guys? i think this might be on the left-hand around part of your screen along with some video that we're seeing here after the attack. neil, what's next? what should we watch for next as we look to get more details and developments from this story? >> well, i think we should, obviously, the norwegians are very concerned that there might even be subsequent attacks. if these attacks are related, they are both, in many respects, suicide attacks. a bombing attack and then a man dressed as a policeman who is on an island. he's not going to get away. he knows that he's going to, essentially, probably be killed as he carries out his attack, killed or apprehended. and you have to remember this island, this is a labor party youth camp, and there are reports that the prime minister was supposed to speak there today, and i don't have any confirmation of that right now.

so these appear to be attacks aimed at the government. this is a center-left government in norway, and, but it is a government that has been very much involved in its nato responsibilities in both afghanistan and can libya. jenna: we'll continue to watch this story, neil. we always appreciate your expertise on these breaking stories overseas or also stateside. neil livingston, again, a terrorism expert with us. we're trying to confirm the most information we can here. in the meantime, go to foxnews.com, check out all the new details there, check it out during the break. we're going to continue to work our sources in norway and be back with the latest developments right after the break. with diabetes, it's tough to keep life balanced. i don't always have time to eat like i should. that's why i like glucerna shakes. they have slowly digestible carbs to help minimize blood sugar spikes, which can help lower a1c. [ ma announcer ] glucerna. helping people with diabetes find balance.

jenna: breaking news out of norway, we want to keep you up up-to-date on developments we

got during the commercial break. again, reports of this attack of a man dressed as a policeman attacking a youth camp just outside of oslo, norway, it's on an island, and this youth camp, according to our sister network, sky news, has about 500-700 people in attendance, and the ages of those people, again, we've talked about it as a youth camp, but the ages range from 15-25. we're trying to find out more if we can confirm there was, indeed, an attack. we heard, again, reports of maybe four people injured, and we have yet to make any confirmation of a connection to a bomb blast that happened in the capital city of oslo. as we get more details, we will bring those to you. rick: well, there's a brand new book revealing secrets on one of the biggest threats facing the world, the pirates who operate in the waters off somalia. and the numbers show that this is a growing danger. in 2008 42 ships were hijacked

off the coast of somalia. pirates commandeered 45 vessels in the 2009, and last year the number taken over by force rising to 49. there have been 17 hijackings so far this year, and the pace is down from a little bit earlier. but the overall number of attacks is up. jay is the author of a book called "the pirates of somalia: inside their hidden world." jay spent three months with these modern day buccaneers, and he writes about it in his new book. thank you very much for coming in. how did you gain access to them? >> it was very fortuitous, because my original plan was to show up on the coast, ask for directions and hope they took pity on me, thought i was a madman and took me into their graces. but i ended up working with a local journalist whose father was elected governor of puntland. this family, this new ruling

subclan was the same as a lot of these fishermen pirates. everything in somalia's done through family connection. rick: who are these pirates and be who's backing them? >> it depends on the time period you're talking about. the gang i was embedded in through much of 2009 were these original fishermen pirates who had been driven to their trade because of really destructive foreign fishing. now what you see is -- rick: not about fishing at all. >> no, certainly not. and can there's a very real pirate pr machine at work that every pirate you speak to the first lines out of his mouth are we're doing this because of foreign fishing, you know? is the american ship that captured us destroyed our nets and fishing gear and so on. but really all the pirates we see out there now are kind of militiamen, gunmen who are hired to do a job, and it's all about money now. rick: hired, and i was interested to read that the low-level pirates, their wages are only about $10 an hour. >> right.

yeah. there was one gang i constructed a financial statement for the gang, and for these lower down, these were the holders of the guards brought onboard just to take care of the hostages and, you know, guard them during the ship's captivity, yeah, made $10 an hour. so that worked out to about $12,000 for spending months of their lives on a ship. and really, you know n somalia you can burn through $10,000 as quickly as you can here if you want to, right? there's always people looking to score that money. rick: a lot of countries are spending a lot of money to try to figure out ways to defeat these pirates. what do you think about those efforts? >> i think the naval missions, right now there's three main naval missions off the coast of somalia including task force 151 based around the u.s. fifth fleet in that area. but these are all more an exercise in defense theater, i think. they really do very little to directly prevent piracy. in the 2009 i think i calculated they stopped six attacks in the

indian ocean, and really at a cost of, you know, a billion to a billion and a half a year depending on how many ships are there at a given time. it's really, it's not a good return. rick: very interesting story. jay's book is called "the pirates of somalia: inside their hidden world." i understand you gave one of them a toronto blue jays shirt. a pittsburgh pirates shirt would have been more appropriate. [laughter] jenna, over to you. jenna: after a quick break, go to foxnews.com for the latest developments. we'll be right back. ♪ let me entertain you

♪ let me make you smile ♪ let me do a few tricks ♪ some old and then some new tricks ♪ ♪ i'm very versatile ♪ so let me entertain you ♪ and we'll have a real good time ♪ [ male announcer ] with beats audio and flash, you can experience richer music and download movies straight to the new hp touchpad with webos.

[ malennouncer ] if it's tr that sharks can sense even a drop of blood from a quarter of a mile away, which razor would you use? ♪ ♪ ♪ [ tires squeal ] an accidendoesn't have to slow you down. with better car replacement, available only from

liberty mutual insurance, the money to buy a car that's one model-year newer with 15,000 fewer miles on it. there's no other auto insurance product like it. better car replacement, available only from liberty mutual. that gets you a better car. call... or visit one of our local offices today, and we'll provide the coverage you need at the right price. liberty mutual auto insurance -- responsibility. what's your policy? rick: busy couple hours, right? >> jenna: a lot going on, d.c. and the debt and this big international story as well. rick: the story out of norway is driving the news, and we get reports there are people who were shot outside of that camp in oslo, norway. that does it for us, "america live" starts right now. martha: that's